MIlton, unfortunately I am one of the "usual suspects" in our region. Since I believe, as I said, that the final choice will be by WG "inner circle" (UN/ITU I guess), I am not sure we should spend more energy on discussing nominations, and I would suggest that the latest version of the suggestions' list just be sent Markus, and let us move on to other issues. --c.a. Em Tuesday 24 August 2004 12:32, Milton Mueller escreveu: > Carlos: > > First, don't forget to use "reply all" if you respond to this ;-) > > Second, more interesting to me than your belief that Bill > is smart (which does not really respond to the concerns that > were raised about him) is the question of your own status, > or the status of other Latin Americans who might be suitable > for the WGIG. Are you interested in this position, are there > others from the region, other than the "usual suspects," > whose names might be put forward? > > --MM > > >>> "carlos a. afonso" <[log in to unmask]> 08/23/04 11:35PM >>> > > [also intended to go to the list, but sent instead just to Adam -- my > mistake --c.a.] > > -----Original Message----- > From: "carlos a. afonso" <[log in to unmask]> > To: "Adam Peake" <[log in to unmask]> > Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:17:48 -0300 > Subject: Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Some comments on WGIG nominees > > Well, I feel like I am a more stringent critic than Bill regarding the > whole ICANN structure (hard for me to say and swallow the inevitable > truth: we do not have another one to look forward to at this point, so > let us try and work inside it but anchored on a strong political > guidance from the outside ot it). > > I have had the opportunity to work with Bill in the context of an SSRC > program (one of the most brilliant fellows I ever met), and I must > agree > with Adam here, but, again, let us make sure we follow a fully open > procedure for a suggested names' list. > > I would not dare calling it nomination, since the WG will in essence > decide "internally" who will be able to join the group, as I grasped > from three meetings with Markus in KL (we could not stand each other > anymore ::))). > > fraternal rgds > > --c.a. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Adam Peake <[log in to unmask]> > To: [log in to unmask] > Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 13:46:30 +0900 > Subject: Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Some comments on WGIG nominees > > > Actually, I was trying to make a different point when I mentioned > > Paul, Bill, Susan, etc. Anyway... > > > > >>Bill Drake (who has made v. important contributions to WSIS civil > > >>society on ICT governance, understands the ICT for development > > >>aspects > > > > > >I know Bill well. He is part of my world, an academic political > > >scientist > > >with a good knowledge of global governance processes. His strength > > >is in traditional telecom institutions like ITU and trade in > > > > telecomm > > > > >services > > >in the WTO. "ICT for development" has never been one of his > > research > > > >areas and he doesn't spend time in developing countries, so don't > > >oversell > > >him there Adam. He is smart and creative and would be very vocal. > > He > > > is > > > > >just as undiplomatic as Karl Auerbach, he is reknowned for his > > >directness. > > >(Might be interesting for Adam to explain the double standard > > here.) > > > I find Bill to be diplomatic, and anyone who has seen him work in > > WSIS would agree. And I really do object to everything been turned > > to > > > personal attack "Adam to explain the double standard here." > > > > Stop it. > > > > >I have two problems with Bill. One is that he has had real trouble > > >grasping > > >and accepting the importance of ICANN as a governance model, > > >and the importance of the ICANN issue in the creation of the WGIG. > > >He has never attended an ICANN meeting, and his technical knowledge > > >of Internet is weak. As late as December 2003 he was insisting that > > >the WSIS Internet Governance Caucus rename itself the "Global ICT > > >Governance" caucus because Internet governance was so "narrow and > > >unimportant." > > > > > >The other is that I think the other two No. American nominees are > > >preferable. I think that Susan Crawford has given much more thought > > >to the broad range of IG issues, and that Pam Samuelson > > >has a much better grasp of the central IPR issues, and so would > > > > prefer > > > > >the other names for North America over him. But I would not > > consider > > > >him > > >unacceptable. > > > > This is a very unfair and inaccurate description of Bill Drake's > > work > > > generally, and work in WSIS specifically (out of context as usual.) > > It's all public record and I hope we will not see selective quoting > > to try and distort that record. > > > > This is a very good example of why the "winnowing process" must be > > done in public, not the private method suggested. Too often we are > > not able to be impartial when personalities are involved. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Adam > > > > >Re: Pindar Wong - I am surprised to see him nominated by Norbert. > > >Pindar is a very smart man. He pioneered the ISP industry in Hong > > >Kong (and cleverly sold off the business just before the rush > > >of competition made it unprofitable). He was an ICANN Board > > >member appointed by the ASO. He was a key figure in the formation > > >of the Asia Internet Association, an ISP trade association. Pindar > > > > is > > > > >the consummate insider. He fulfills all the criteria that Adam > > > > thinks > > > > >Karl > > >Auerbach doesn't have: he won't rock the boat, he will be > > > > diplomatic, > > > > >he will make insider deals. The problem is, there is no real nexus > > > > with > > > > >the values and principles of this constituency. I've known him and > > >watched > > >him for years and I don't know what he believes on policy issues; > > he > > > >seems > > >to be a pure pragmatist. He is a businessman. He has personal > > >integrity. But > > >I do not see how he can be expected to represent or give voice to > > > > the > > > > >values > > >and policies favored by civil society in a global process. And I > > > > don't > > > > >think > > >he would be answerable to civil society; I think his identity as a > > >businessman > > >and insider would override other considerations, although I do > > think > > > he > > > > >would > > >make an effort to communicate with us. > > > > > >--MM -- Carlos A. Afonso diretor de planejamento e estratégia Rits - Rede de Informações para o Terceiro Setor Rua Guilhermina Guinle 272 - sexto andar 22270-060 Rio de Janeiro BRASIL telefone +55-21-2527-5494 telefax +55-21-2527-5460 http://www.rits.org.br