Sounds good Ayden, let us know what you find. Thank YOU, -Michael On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 3:12 PM, Ayden Férdeline <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Hmm… I need to research this topic more, because it is important to > understand why we have this divergence away from the technical structures. > My initial thought is that it's probably to do with participation in agenda > setting and decision-making processes. It's not enough to just be a member > of a Regional Internet Registry (I believe these are/were at time open to > any country, regardless of its geographical location); you want the people > of countries to actively be supported in their outreach initiatives and to > feel like their perspectives matter. So you might want to fall within a > regional structure where you have shared interests, common languages, or > political recognition. I'm not saying that's what happens in practice — but > I can understand the train of thought. I'll do some more research to > understand the RIRs and what would be involved in starting a new one, as my > knowledge of this area is currently non-existent. > > Thanks, > > Ayden > > On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 12:53 PM, Michael Oghia [log in to unmask] wrote: > >> Ayden, >> >> I figured that was the case. To me, it would make more sense for ICANN's >> regional delineations to follow the RIRs' delineations. That way, even if >> certain artificial constructions exist, they are at the very least >> streamlined across Internet communities -- specifically when RIRs work so >> closely with IANA and ICANN. >> >> Best, >> -Michael >> >> >> On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 2:39 PM, Ayden Férdeline <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> Hi Michael, >> >> From ICANN's perspective, I would think it comes down to cost. They would >> need to provide additional meeting rooms at ICANN meetings, perhaps >> increase the travel support budget, expand Adobe Connect capabilities, >> enlarge the RALOs so that they mirror the geographical regions framework, >> and provide additional Staff resources to manage all of this. And I don't >> think we could get away with just adding the Caribbean either, what about >> Arab nations? Small Pacific islands? And there's probably a legitimate >> claim for South East Asia being a region of its own, too… >> >> The regions are confusing as it is at the moment. One report I read >> provided this example, that “ccTLD managers in the Middle East are by >> definition part of ICANN’s Asian, Australian, Pacific Region. At the same >> time, for the allocation of IP number resources, they rely on RIPE NCC, the >> Regional Internet Registry for Europe and the Middle East, and therefore >> are considered to be part of the European Region. If somebody from the >> Middle East were elected through the ccNSO to serve on its Council or the >> ICANN Board, he or she would be considered to originate from the Asian, >> Australian Pacific Region. If elected through the ASO to serve on the ASO >> EC or the ICANN Board that same person would take a seat for the European >> Region.” Do we want to add to the confusion here and to further expand the >> regions? >> >> I'm not sure what the best solution is. All I know is that the current >> framework is broken, and that the regions - no matter how we classify >> countries - are going to be some kind of artificial construction. I >> understand that the community is dissatisfied with ICANN's current regional >> structures. I am told they adversely impact their representation and >> participation in ICANN activities. If someone could please provide some >> specific examples of this, that would be great. A relevant case study which >> we could add to our statement to demonstrate how ICANN's current framework >> harms the NCSG would, in my view, be a strong addition. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> Ayden >> >> On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 12:20 PM, Michael Oghia [log in to unmask] wrote: >> >> Out of curiousity: Is there any reason why the Caribbean couldn't be see >> as its own region, aside from brevity? >> >> Best, >> -Michael >> __________________ >> >> Michael J. Oghia >> Istanbul, Turkey >> Journalist & editor >> 2015 ISOC IGF Ambassador >> Skype: mikeoghia >> Twitter <https://www.twitter.com/MikeOghia> *|* LinkedIn >> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikeoghia> >> >> On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 2:06 PM, Shane Kerr <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> Seun, >> >> While ARIN predates ICANN, when ICANN was formed ARIN was still the RIR >> for North America, South America, and sub-Saharan Africa. Certainly in >> the case of Jamaica, since the official language is English it made a >> certain amount of sense for them to have stayed with ARIN as an RIR. >> >> The Caribbean islands all have unique backgrounds, and I suspect trying >> to group them to get any kind of regional consensus is always going to >> be problematic. :) >> >> Cheers, >> >> -- >> Shane >> >> At 2016-03-29 21:55:41 +0100 >> Seun Ojedeji <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >> > That particularly amazed me Tracy. There is an ARIN meeting that will be >> > holding in Jamaica sometime in April. It was quite interesting for me to >> > learn that based on ICANN categorisation, .jm fall under the LAC zone >> even >> > though it's within the ARIN region (RIR wise). Don't know how much this >> > impacts on the work of the NCSG but I believe it does for the At-Large >> > community. >> > >> > Considering that ARIN predates ICANN, one would expect there is already >> > existing data set to work with. Nevertheless, I guess there may have >> been >> > some other reason that informed their decision which ofcourse is >> currently >> > be out of my reach/grasps >> > >> > Regards >> > >> > Sent from my LG G4 >> > Kindly excuse brevity and typos >> > On 29 Mar 2016 9:08 p.m., “Tracy F. Hackshaw” <[log in to unmask]> >> > wrote: >> > >> > > See ARIN - LACNIC split in the Caribbean region. >> > > >> > > Sent from my Fire >> > > >> > > >> > > On March 29, 2016, at 3:26 PM, Ayden Férdeline <[log in to unmask]> >> > > wrote: >> > > >> > > >> > > Hi Karel, >> > > >> > > While that concern was raised, my understanding is that it was not >> carried >> > > forward into the recommendations. The Working Group did not recommend >> > > moving most of the Caribbean region from the ICANN silo of Latin >> America to >> > > North America because it feared the two regions would be split on >> > > geographical and linguistic lines (I would suggest they already are…), >> > > among other reasons of “practicality”. It does, however, have >> provisions in >> > > place to allow a country's government to voluntarily request to move >> to >> > > another region. The procedures around how this would happen have not >> yet >> > > been developed by Staff. >> > > >> > > I welcome any comments or suggestions you might have for our >> statement, >> > > and I look forward to reading your additions. >> > > >> > > Best wishes, >> > > >> > > Ayden >> > > >> > > >> > > On Tue, Mar 29, 2016 at 7:59 PM, Karel Douglas < >> [log in to unmask]> >> > > wrote: >> > > >> > >> Good work - I read the NCUC report which caused me to immediately >> > >> read the final report of the WG. >> > >> >> > >> I'm glad that the issue of the Caribbean region was discussed as it >> is a >> > >> very topical issue. >> > >> >> > >> Carlton Samuels was on the WG and would have highlighted the concerns >> > >> that we have. >> > >> >> > >> I will certainly try to add a few comments on your document. >> > >> >> > >> regards >> > >> >> > >> Karel >> > >> >> > >> On Tue, Mar 29, 2016 at 1:26 PM, Ayden Férdeline < >> [log in to unmask]> >> > >> wrote: >> > >> >> > >>> Hello, team- >> > >>> >> > >>> I have drafted a response to the final report of the Geographic >> Regions >> > >>> Review Working Group. Comments are due in about 25 days time but if >> we do >> > >>> decide to reply, I hope we can submit something in advance of that >> > >>> deadline. I've shared my first draft on Google Docs here >> > >>> < >> https://links8.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/l/Dd5veWqTH5ASiyVjh?rn=IyczV3YzlGZgc2cj5mI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0czV3YzlGZtc2cj5mI >> > >> > >>> and have also attached it to this email for those without access to >> that >> > >>> website. >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-c2vVT2DNO73l89wfZTvKtY70rmaid8g7XBO-Vto9SM/edit >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> You can read the Working Group's final report here: >> > >>> https://www.icann.org/public-comments/geo-regions-2015-12-23-en >> > >>> >> > >>> I suspect that we will have a wide birth of opinions on this topic, >> so >> > >>> please know that I'm very much open to reviewing or rethinking >> anything >> > >>> that appears in this early draft. I am also new to writing public >> comments >> > >>> like this one so welcome any feedback you would be kind enough to >> share. I >> > >>> look forward to hearing your thoughts. >> > >>> >> > >>> Best wishes, >> > >>> >> > >>> Ayden Férdeline >> > >>> >> > >>> [image: File] >> > >>> < >> https://files10.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/f/BCMNixTRUUztzxobj/?messageId=8M4p5UFRgKhkng2my&rn=IyczV3YzlGZgc2cj5mI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0czV3YzlGZtc2cj5mI >> > >> > >>> Ayden Ferdeline - Response - WGGR Report.pdf 36KB >> > >>> < >> https://files10.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/f/BCMNixTRUUztzxobj/?messageId=8M4p5UFRgKhkng2my&rn=IyczV3YzlGZgc2cj5mI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0czV3YzlGZtc2cj5mI> >> Download >> > >>> >> > >>> < >> https://files10.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/f/BCMNixTRUUztzxobj/?messageId=8M4p5UFRgKhkng2my&rn=IyczV3YzlGZgc2cj5mI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0czV3YzlGZtc2cj5mI> >> [image: >> > >>> Logo] >> > >>> < >> https://files10.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/f/BCMNixTRUUztzxobj/?messageId=8M4p5UFRgKhkng2my&rn=IyczV3YzlGZgc2cj5mI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0czV3YzlGZtc2cj5mI >> > >> > >>> >> > >> >> > >> >> > > >> > > Ayden Férdeline >> > > Statement of Interest >> > > < >> https://links3.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/l/O3C68GH6eSvhsgLYk?rn=gIVRURuIVWT5iVSV0UUNVSMB0UTV1QTlERtc0UD5kI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0UTV1QTlERtc0UD5kI >> > >> > > >> > > >> > > Ayden Férdeline >> > > Statement of Interest >> > > < >> https://links5.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/l/iJxcFOO15b8EdscAg?rn=gIVRURuIVWT5iVSV0UUNVSMB0UTV1QTlERtc0UD5kI&re=gI1RWZuIXez5idyV2c0NXasB0UTV1QTlERtc0UD5kI >> > >> > > >> >> >> >> Ayden Férdeline >> Statement of Interest >> <https://links9.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/l/0SKzsEgn64j4q4C7G?rn=&re=gIt92YuwWah12ZAFWaod2buU2ap1mI> >> >> >> > Ayden Férdeline > Statement of Interest > <https://links5.mixmaxusercontent.com/aMjjKHWxnLSD3SEwj/l/Bc6BZycYKNzF669J9?rn=iEWaod2TgwWZhh2Yp1kI&re=gIt92YuwWah12ZAFWaod2buU2ap1mI> >